I found this quite interesting article on how this one practitioner found Wing Chun had failed him, and how he discovered what he was seeking in BJJ.
Now, although he's quite one of the "WC is poo and I know 'coz I've done it" folk that might be a bit dismaying, a bunch of what he says is true particularly the non-sparrning in WC. Sometimes we'll 'simulate' attacks from an opponent, but this to me is so sterile, false, and utterly unrealistic. Your partner will often be coming in so slowly, weakly and without any commitment that the techniques you're applying appears to work but there's so much doubt left in my mind on whether it actually does.
Sometimes, we might do a bit of 'box'. The best 'simulation' I've experienced so far, but only the top seniors are allowed to cope with that. Although, again, it's a bunch of people coming in without much commitment.
I do wish I could pad up. Not feel that I need to hold back, and the same for my partner, and really see if my techniques hold up.
In the old days Bruce Lee and his peers just had their street fights. That's where their real 'training' happened for him. How else are you ever going to learn what works for you and what doesn't?
And as mmabjj himself said, he was left with so much to wonder about his abilities that when he tried out his 'skills' on the street he failed miserably. No frickin wonder he lost faith in his WC.
And have I? No, I'm neither deluded nor disillusioned in WC itself. Just in my training. I know it's not the answer to everything, and even if it were it's how 'fluent' (and verbose) the practitioner is that is crucial. I've never been anywhere near to the 'real world' situations that would call for my using WC, so can I be anywhere near fluent. It's the same as someone learning Chinese from CDs in their car and thinking they can handle it, and when they get over to Shanghai they're totally screwed, coz they never actually conversed with anyone.
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7 comments:
We do sparring in Wong Shung Leung Wing Chun regularly.
I think it is the best possible thing closest to a real fight.
It needs a basic control and trust in the skills of your sparring partner. However, although I think I can spar well I often realized that I suck in a real stress situation. I totally can not estimate if I should punch now to destroy or just keep back ( al my doubts vanish after I got a first hit normally...).
So I think sparring is essential because you see that most of the techniques you believe you can use will be gone.
Anyway just keep training and have faith. What I also do is to go to other wing chung schools and search for training partners. It totally helps finding people with different attitudes.
Thanks for your encouragement and advice. I've had to stop WC because of long-term back problems.
Wong Shung Leung - wow
Is that in the UK and for all WSL clubs or is that unique to your instructor?
I had a long discussion with my Si-Hing about this, and he said that the best drill for dealing with oncoming attacks is the "stand in front of each other and punch towards the centre line". The person "controlling" will randomly shout change and you have to switch to either the outside or inside "gate".
Whatever comes your way, your instinct it to throw punches out and the changes give you some adapting. I feel that it's still a drill though.
His main point about sparring is that if someone who you see as your equal or "junior" gets good hits in on you, then it's not going to be pretty. You may well lose confidence.
Fair enough, but I personally feel that if you learn to control your ego (that's damned hard) then the lessons in humility are good.
And he's had real fights and won them all. He therefore doesn't need to see the value in sparring.
But he didn't say not to.
I am sorry to hear that. Funnily enough, when I started (some years ago now) I had back pain and they vanished due to WC.
Although I have to admit that the main reason was due to additional workout drills to strengthen my back muscles (especially shoulders and neck). In contrast, my wife did WC and stopped due to back pain but she also does not do the additional drills and her pain is in lower regions of the spine.
My school is in zürich/switzerland althoug it is associated to Philip Bayer who sits in Germany.
There are luckily 2 good students of Wong in Europe, one is Clive in the UK and the other one is philip in Germany.
>Whatever comes your way, your >instinct it to throw punches out >and the changes give you some >adapting. I feel that it's still a >drill though.
Indeed that is a good drill for beginners. You learn adaption and reflexes.
Well, I guess the best training is a balanced one but life is too short to do all thorough enough :-)
Hi
Sorry I hadn't responded for so long. I kind of gave up on this blog for a while and didn't see your comment.
I did some research into the "Yee Ji Kim Yeung Mah" and the locking of the hips puts the lower lumbar under considerable strain - it's just that most people don't notice it as it's no worse than sitting really badly like slouching on a park bench.
I simple can't do that stance anymore as I have problems with my spine down there.
Anything that causes lower back pain has to be completely avoided if one is sensible. If it's only the stance, then what I've been doing is a semi-horse, Tai Chi style stance for the form.
Thanks for the link btw - I've linked back to you. Thank you for sharing your experiences on your blog!
Nice website, I like those who dedicate into promoting the art of wing chun.
Instructor Antony Garcia
http://www.geocities.com/arnis_wingchun_monterrey/
Live training has to be an essential part of your training, I believe a combination of chi sau and sparring, exchaning chain punches and other strikes.. Nothing can ever replicate a real fight but live training can come close. You have a partner who is non-compliant and there are no pre-set movments.
Nice blog. You can train in BJJ while you study WSL wing chun, and why not try to apply wing chun principles to your grappling? Wing chun has grappling concepts and they are very effective in ground fighting application. Keep up the training, peace from athens.
http://www.youtube.com/user/bknives
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